villamonte6100
12-14 02:22 PM
I still dont see any discrimination on the existing laws. The number of visas divided equally to all countries.
If no one (including the Govt.) is allowed to discriminate based on national origin then how can the Govt. discriminate on EB Emigration based on national origin ?
I think this is a fair question and most Americans in my work place agree with me. I don't know if we will win the case or not but if we win we can get
1) Removal of country based quotas
2) recapture of Visa's lost due to country based quotas
If we lose the case we will at least get more attention of the national media, it's up to us how we manage the media attention and have a positive effect on the popularity of our cause.
IMHO taking the opinion of the best attorney on constitutional law can not hurt. :)
If no one (including the Govt.) is allowed to discriminate based on national origin then how can the Govt. discriminate on EB Emigration based on national origin ?
I think this is a fair question and most Americans in my work place agree with me. I don't know if we will win the case or not but if we win we can get
1) Removal of country based quotas
2) recapture of Visa's lost due to country based quotas
If we lose the case we will at least get more attention of the national media, it's up to us how we manage the media attention and have a positive effect on the popularity of our cause.
IMHO taking the opinion of the best attorney on constitutional law can not hurt. :)
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reddy77
09-23 02:10 PM
Yes, mine was approved a month back without any hassles and bought the home ....
Has anybody really tried to get a mortgage recently? I have been denied by 8 lenders so far simply because I don't have a green card. Most lenders have tightened their underwriting guidelines. They will give mortgages only to U.S.Citizens or somebody who is a permanent resident aka having a green card. There are very very few lenders who will give mortgages to somebody on a visa and the rates may not be very favorable.
Has anybody really tried to get a mortgage recently? I have been denied by 8 lenders so far simply because I don't have a green card. Most lenders have tightened their underwriting guidelines. They will give mortgages only to U.S.Citizens or somebody who is a permanent resident aka having a green card. There are very very few lenders who will give mortgages to somebody on a visa and the rates may not be very favorable.
walking_dude
02-14 09:37 AM
hopefulgc - also make the commitments clear! Its not just sufficient to support ( as in moral support) the cause. Its important to participate in it.
I think someone should change the Poll question to -
Q) Do you commit to participate in a class action lawsuit against USCIS?
1) Yes. I am willing to commit $500
2) Yes. I'm willing to be a plaintiff ( full name and full contact info required)
3) Yes. I'm willing to commit $500 and become a plaintiff as well
4) No. I don't think it will work
It will make it clear to everyone voting 'Yes' what's expected of them.
hopefulgc - please dedicate some time and update your first post with more information on lawsuit, you may want to quote lazycis 's posts and other information.
A lot of people may not be very knowledgable and may backoff when they see the word "lawsuit".
Those who are saying YES on the poll - it is assumed that you will not backoff - if you have not yet updated your profile on IV - please update your complete profile - this will show that you can be counted on.
I think someone should change the Poll question to -
Q) Do you commit to participate in a class action lawsuit against USCIS?
1) Yes. I am willing to commit $500
2) Yes. I'm willing to be a plaintiff ( full name and full contact info required)
3) Yes. I'm willing to commit $500 and become a plaintiff as well
4) No. I don't think it will work
It will make it clear to everyone voting 'Yes' what's expected of them.
hopefulgc - please dedicate some time and update your first post with more information on lawsuit, you may want to quote lazycis 's posts and other information.
A lot of people may not be very knowledgable and may backoff when they see the word "lawsuit".
Those who are saying YES on the poll - it is assumed that you will not backoff - if you have not yet updated your profile on IV - please update your complete profile - this will show that you can be counted on.
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ArkBird
04-01 02:56 AM
Here are some of the debacle of Nehru. Some are STILL hunting us and world today.
1. Choosing self over country (see "Sardar" movie for more details. All of congress wanted Sardar Patel as PM but Nehru insisted on him being PM. Can you imagine country today if Sardar Patel would have been the first PM of India?)
2. His promise to hold public referendum in J&K under UN. Why should we invite UN for our internal matter?? Specially when the king of Kashmir has signed union with India himself.
3. 1962 debacle. Though may not be a big deal to some people, it gave unrepairable scare which will hunt us and our army for decades to come.
It is true everyone has made some sacrifices but consider if India were not a free country and if Nehru and others like Mahatma Gandhi didn't dedicate themselves to the cause of nation then would we be better off today? We failed to carry the torch left by them for us.
Has anyone asked them to vote for Nehru dynasty after the blunders? Didnt anyone see it coming? Building society is everyone's responsibility. Not just Nehru or his children's.
This is like saying we wasted one spot in Indian cricket team on Sachin Tendulkar when he scored 0 in some matches or didnt win a match for India.
It is team work and collective responsibility that will make this country prosper. Blaming some person by saying all his fault and we are here because he screwed us is not the right thing to do. It just finds a scapegoat and does not solve the problem. We should learn from the mistakes the country has made and learn from them and move forward.
1. Choosing self over country (see "Sardar" movie for more details. All of congress wanted Sardar Patel as PM but Nehru insisted on him being PM. Can you imagine country today if Sardar Patel would have been the first PM of India?)
2. His promise to hold public referendum in J&K under UN. Why should we invite UN for our internal matter?? Specially when the king of Kashmir has signed union with India himself.
3. 1962 debacle. Though may not be a big deal to some people, it gave unrepairable scare which will hunt us and our army for decades to come.
It is true everyone has made some sacrifices but consider if India were not a free country and if Nehru and others like Mahatma Gandhi didn't dedicate themselves to the cause of nation then would we be better off today? We failed to carry the torch left by them for us.
Has anyone asked them to vote for Nehru dynasty after the blunders? Didnt anyone see it coming? Building society is everyone's responsibility. Not just Nehru or his children's.
This is like saying we wasted one spot in Indian cricket team on Sachin Tendulkar when he scored 0 in some matches or didnt win a match for India.
It is team work and collective responsibility that will make this country prosper. Blaming some person by saying all his fault and we are here because he screwed us is not the right thing to do. It just finds a scapegoat and does not solve the problem. We should learn from the mistakes the country has made and learn from them and move forward.
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rahulpaper
06-26 01:51 PM
I sure do hope you are right.....because i am in HR boat as well...
BTW Thanks to you and the core team on CIR front...keep up the good work.
Once again, what is with this "Flood" and "too many". Petitions are postal packages. They are not Tsunami waves that would prompt them to shut down their doors to prevent flooding. They did get nearly 200,000 petitions in Vermont in one day. What happened ? Did the mail room clerk drown in fedex ? Were the packages overflowing in the parking lot ?
Guys please stop thinking these logistics, and get a life. USCIS has people who are capable of predicting several hundred mail packages and handling them. They are inefficient and slow but they are not galactically stupid. And if they stop accepting petitions, it wont be because they have received "Too many" because it takes time to define "too many". So chill and try to file it before 31st July.
These rumors are wreaking havoc on people who are not in a perfect position to control the timing of filing. Many lawyers and many employers will file between 25th and 31st July. And I can accept that. My own HR and lawfirm have made it clear that we will file before 31st July but there is no guarantee that it will be sooner than that and any sooner than that is not neccesary.
Those who are filing on their own can file on July 1st. But those who are depending on lawyers and their own HR, please relax and stop thinking too much.
BTW Thanks to you and the core team on CIR front...keep up the good work.
Once again, what is with this "Flood" and "too many". Petitions are postal packages. They are not Tsunami waves that would prompt them to shut down their doors to prevent flooding. They did get nearly 200,000 petitions in Vermont in one day. What happened ? Did the mail room clerk drown in fedex ? Were the packages overflowing in the parking lot ?
Guys please stop thinking these logistics, and get a life. USCIS has people who are capable of predicting several hundred mail packages and handling them. They are inefficient and slow but they are not galactically stupid. And if they stop accepting petitions, it wont be because they have received "Too many" because it takes time to define "too many". So chill and try to file it before 31st July.
These rumors are wreaking havoc on people who are not in a perfect position to control the timing of filing. Many lawyers and many employers will file between 25th and 31st July. And I can accept that. My own HR and lawfirm have made it clear that we will file before 31st July but there is no guarantee that it will be sooner than that and any sooner than that is not neccesary.
Those who are filing on their own can file on July 1st. But those who are depending on lawyers and their own HR, please relax and stop thinking too much.
hopefulgc
12-13 04:16 PM
whenever a good idea is raised .. we all obey hte dynamics of group behavior and divide ourselves into two parts
FOR and AGAINST the idea..
soon discussion ensues.. and since pessimism is more scary than optimism... and we have other "less viable" alternatives.. the good idea is soon forgotten.
Can we do something different this time and give this great idea the attention it deserves?
FOR and AGAINST the idea..
soon discussion ensues.. and since pessimism is more scary than optimism... and we have other "less viable" alternatives.. the good idea is soon forgotten.
Can we do something different this time and give this great idea the attention it deserves?
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ganguteli
06-04 03:28 PM
The EAD/AC21 is still only available to those who are July 07 filers. There are many who have missed the oppurtunity. What many people are asking for is for something such that anyone can change a job after some given time, irrespective of Visa number availability. Even for those with EAD's, you are still restricted to be in the same field. So if you want a career move and do an MBA or acquire new skills to change your career, you cannot do that (unless EAD is for a dependent). If this is not pigeoning people, what is.
No point trying to get EAD for non AOS filers.
We should rather ask for faster processing of applications, transparency and more accountability.
EAD also has lot of restrictions and our goal should be faster green cards through faster processing and more visa numbers.
No point trying to get EAD for non AOS filers.
We should rather ask for faster processing of applications, transparency and more accountability.
EAD also has lot of restrictions and our goal should be faster green cards through faster processing and more visa numbers.
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Macaca
07-04 12:17 PM
having family members like spouses and children fly in to the U.S. to be able to apply for a green card.
Please verify (with URL) that applicant + dependents have to be in US in order to apply!
Please verify (with URL) that applicant + dependents have to be in US in order to apply!
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akred
02-18 07:35 PM
At high levels; I think there should be no quota on employment base.
Glad to see you agree, however I was refuting your justification of a country quota. The point being that the country quota owes its origin to racial considerations and a fixation on protecting levels of European immigration.
I don't know how one would talk to a politician and tell them to increase the quota and then come up with a number and then explain why it should be that number.
In the short term the EB quota should be set to accomodate or exempt anyone who has held a work visa for a period of time (3 years?). This can be pitched as a retention issue as US employers should not lose employees in whom they have made a significant investment. There can be variations on this theme such as requiring that such employees make at least 120% of the prevailing wage for the occupation.
Glad to see you agree, however I was refuting your justification of a country quota. The point being that the country quota owes its origin to racial considerations and a fixation on protecting levels of European immigration.
I don't know how one would talk to a politician and tell them to increase the quota and then come up with a number and then explain why it should be that number.
In the short term the EB quota should be set to accomodate or exempt anyone who has held a work visa for a period of time (3 years?). This can be pitched as a retention issue as US employers should not lose employees in whom they have made a significant investment. There can be variations on this theme such as requiring that such employees make at least 120% of the prevailing wage for the occupation.
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alterego
12-07 10:38 AM
no comments so far ? and this thread is still visible ..so I guess either people have given up or no one cares (this is weekend ..so I guess less people online).
but I will repeat one last time ..if we cannot link housing and immigration ..then I don't see how anything else can help (can someone educate me).
for eg if we say US is losing talent and brains are leaving ..then I don't think anyone will care especially when economy is down (many natives will be happy I guess).
lawsuits will not help as USCIS will show that they are following law and/or they are understaffed / underfunded.
- flower campaigns or writing to USCIS only will only help flower companies / postal department
flower / letter campaigns help ..but we need a clear plan and lets do brainstorming or atleast show some activity !!
---------
before someone jumps ..let me clarify that I am not suggesting that immigration will solve the housing problem totally ..but immigrants do constitute a very important segment of buyers.
- we don't have to suggest increasing immigrant quota ..but only recapture and tell that these people are already in USA ..majority of them will get GC one day or the other ..this will just speed up the process so that people can settle / buy houses faster
- I don't think u can come up with law saying if u buy house u will get GC ..focus should only be on faster GC and processing ..faster decision is helpful to US too ..as those whose cases will be denied due to law breaking etc ..will be denied sooner.
and hence no distinction between those who are renting and those who are already owners
Not only are immigrants an important category of buyers, but the few who took the leap of faith in this country and bought, might actually be forced to sell into a down market and exacerbate to pressure if this mess is not sorted out.
This current inaction is a dumb policy in many ways IMHO. I hope visa recapture happens soon. If they want to slow down immigration, they ought to do it at the F1/H1b/L1 level/Labor certification. Not at the 485 stage, which is what visa recapture legislation is all about.
but I will repeat one last time ..if we cannot link housing and immigration ..then I don't see how anything else can help (can someone educate me).
for eg if we say US is losing talent and brains are leaving ..then I don't think anyone will care especially when economy is down (many natives will be happy I guess).
lawsuits will not help as USCIS will show that they are following law and/or they are understaffed / underfunded.
- flower campaigns or writing to USCIS only will only help flower companies / postal department
flower / letter campaigns help ..but we need a clear plan and lets do brainstorming or atleast show some activity !!
---------
before someone jumps ..let me clarify that I am not suggesting that immigration will solve the housing problem totally ..but immigrants do constitute a very important segment of buyers.
- we don't have to suggest increasing immigrant quota ..but only recapture and tell that these people are already in USA ..majority of them will get GC one day or the other ..this will just speed up the process so that people can settle / buy houses faster
- I don't think u can come up with law saying if u buy house u will get GC ..focus should only be on faster GC and processing ..faster decision is helpful to US too ..as those whose cases will be denied due to law breaking etc ..will be denied sooner.
and hence no distinction between those who are renting and those who are already owners
Not only are immigrants an important category of buyers, but the few who took the leap of faith in this country and bought, might actually be forced to sell into a down market and exacerbate to pressure if this mess is not sorted out.
This current inaction is a dumb policy in many ways IMHO. I hope visa recapture happens soon. If they want to slow down immigration, they ought to do it at the F1/H1b/L1 level/Labor certification. Not at the 485 stage, which is what visa recapture legislation is all about.
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Googler
02-18 03:58 PM
I do not understand why out of 205 people who voted yes, nobody has :
1) Contacted an attorney with his own money if they are so interested?
2) Nobody has agreed to become a plaintiff except Googler.
Googler, why don't you lead this effort and become the plaintiff and get a lawyer to start filing a case? You can file a class action lawsuit on behalf of all immigrant community. Once you file the case people will thank you and appreciate your bravery.
I do not think this lawsuit idea will go anywhere unless someone is willing to risk his greencard for it. Because once you become a plaintiff USCIS will review your case more thoroughly. Plus you need to get your employer on the same page for it. You also need to spend thousands of dollars from your own pocket to take part in your lawsuit.
Another thing, I do not trust lawyers opinion in this matter unless a lawyer is a litigation lawyer. If a lawfirm is good at filing paperwork and filling applications, they cannot do a class action lawsuit. They may show interest in it for money and publicity. You need to get a litigation lawyer only for it.
I've said this before but perhaps I'll have to say it many more times till it sinks in
... the thinking on this is at a VERY VERY VERY preliminary stage. In real life class action lawsuits, named plaintiffs are chosen based on how well they fit the argument in the case, not the other way round. As I said upthread, all those who want decisions, deals, money etc RIGHT NOW are being pretty unrealistic -- probably just because of unfamiliarity with the progress of cases like this. I know people want to be reassured that there is NO risk of losing, every decision node is mapped out, responsibility assigned, but if that is what anyone is thinking they have to rejigger their thinking. ;-)
IV members should also be aware that all we need are a few named plaintiffs, it isn't as though every IV member or even everyone wanting to sue needs to be a named plaintiff. All the judge needs to recognize is that there is a large group of applicants with same or similar grounds for suing USCIS/Emilio Gonzalez. Edit to add: IV the organization doesn't even need to be the primary plaintiff, since that will necessarily cutoff any parallel discussion with the agencies. The IV forums are just a place to organize this.
Internet, if you voted no, why are you so worked up about it? Nobody is about to make you do anything you don't want to do. Carry on with your life, this is not about to impinge you negatively. Why do you care what other people do with their time?
For people who voted yes, it is worth thinking about what you are willing to do for the effort -- at present, all that is needed is an interest and willingness to read and do some research and THAT IS ALL. Read the two paragraphs I quoted above.
As far as contacting attorneys and moving the ball forward, it is a time consuming process -- it isn't as though they call you right back with a draft brief and legal arguments. This is not an ordinary paperwork issue. It has after all been a grand total of 6 days since the poll was started on 2-12-08!! ;-)
1) Contacted an attorney with his own money if they are so interested?
2) Nobody has agreed to become a plaintiff except Googler.
Googler, why don't you lead this effort and become the plaintiff and get a lawyer to start filing a case? You can file a class action lawsuit on behalf of all immigrant community. Once you file the case people will thank you and appreciate your bravery.
I do not think this lawsuit idea will go anywhere unless someone is willing to risk his greencard for it. Because once you become a plaintiff USCIS will review your case more thoroughly. Plus you need to get your employer on the same page for it. You also need to spend thousands of dollars from your own pocket to take part in your lawsuit.
Another thing, I do not trust lawyers opinion in this matter unless a lawyer is a litigation lawyer. If a lawfirm is good at filing paperwork and filling applications, they cannot do a class action lawsuit. They may show interest in it for money and publicity. You need to get a litigation lawyer only for it.
I've said this before but perhaps I'll have to say it many more times till it sinks in
... the thinking on this is at a VERY VERY VERY preliminary stage. In real life class action lawsuits, named plaintiffs are chosen based on how well they fit the argument in the case, not the other way round. As I said upthread, all those who want decisions, deals, money etc RIGHT NOW are being pretty unrealistic -- probably just because of unfamiliarity with the progress of cases like this. I know people want to be reassured that there is NO risk of losing, every decision node is mapped out, responsibility assigned, but if that is what anyone is thinking they have to rejigger their thinking. ;-)
IV members should also be aware that all we need are a few named plaintiffs, it isn't as though every IV member or even everyone wanting to sue needs to be a named plaintiff. All the judge needs to recognize is that there is a large group of applicants with same or similar grounds for suing USCIS/Emilio Gonzalez. Edit to add: IV the organization doesn't even need to be the primary plaintiff, since that will necessarily cutoff any parallel discussion with the agencies. The IV forums are just a place to organize this.
Internet, if you voted no, why are you so worked up about it? Nobody is about to make you do anything you don't want to do. Carry on with your life, this is not about to impinge you negatively. Why do you care what other people do with their time?
For people who voted yes, it is worth thinking about what you are willing to do for the effort -- at present, all that is needed is an interest and willingness to read and do some research and THAT IS ALL. Read the two paragraphs I quoted above.
As far as contacting attorneys and moving the ball forward, it is a time consuming process -- it isn't as though they call you right back with a draft brief and legal arguments. This is not an ordinary paperwork issue. It has after all been a grand total of 6 days since the poll was started on 2-12-08!! ;-)
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hiralal
06-15 09:36 PM
Just hang on to your jobs or find a job if you loose one. You will get your GC. GC shouldn't stop you from pursuing your interests buying house or starting a business, there are always ways to do it.
I am guessing that your intention is good but the advice is BAD (to put it mildly).
Find a new job if you are on H1 / or even EAD -- first try the same and then let us know.
regarding buying house - if you are welder from Korea - sure go ahead even if you PD is 2006. if from China / India -- just forget it for the time being ... it will add too much stress in your life ..better have the money in liquid form. it is good to be optimistic but you need to be a realist first ..as others have said, if they cannot print a plastic green card for you then it is foolish for you to invest your hard earned money in real estate
I am guessing that your intention is good but the advice is BAD (to put it mildly).
Find a new job if you are on H1 / or even EAD -- first try the same and then let us know.
regarding buying house - if you are welder from Korea - sure go ahead even if you PD is 2006. if from China / India -- just forget it for the time being ... it will add too much stress in your life ..better have the money in liquid form. it is good to be optimistic but you need to be a realist first ..as others have said, if they cannot print a plastic green card for you then it is foolish for you to invest your hard earned money in real estate
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dontcareanymore
06-24 06:21 PM
..I am waiting for the punch line. What's the point of this? We all know it...
Exactly !!
Exactly !!
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lazycis
02-14 02:59 PM
Life's not simple. It's not A or B. It's usually A and B that succeeds. Like I mentioned in an earlier post going ahead with option A (lawsuit) closes option B ( meetings and negotiations).
Best approach is IV keeps option B (lobbying) open while a group that agrees option A is better continues to pursue it. There is a lot of support for this measure here. What it lacks is a convinced leadership! Once the leadership emerges and there is action on the ground, who knows, the skeptics may join too.
Totally agree. A and B are not mutually exclusive. We need to push for admin fix and in the meantime explore lawsuit possibility WITHOUT using IV name (does not mean IV members cannot participate as individuals in the lawsuit).
Best approach is IV keeps option B (lobbying) open while a group that agrees option A is better continues to pursue it. There is a lot of support for this measure here. What it lacks is a convinced leadership! Once the leadership emerges and there is action on the ground, who knows, the skeptics may join too.
Totally agree. A and B are not mutually exclusive. We need to push for admin fix and in the meantime explore lawsuit possibility WITHOUT using IV name (does not mean IV members cannot participate as individuals in the lawsuit).
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kshitijnt
03-30 06:56 AM
Agreed but consider the other options. Lalu? Mulayam?? Mayawati???
I will have tears of joy in my eyes if BJP get the majority but I know it will never happen... :(
Laloos performance as railway minister is amazing. He can make a good PM. Anyday better than Rahul baba.
I will have tears of joy in my eyes if BJP get the majority but I know it will never happen... :(
Laloos performance as railway minister is amazing. He can make a good PM. Anyday better than Rahul baba.
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mkumar
05-11 08:50 PM
Wrong! Stop assuming dude. People are here because they need the Green Card. We don't take an oath to renounce loyalties when we get it. Of course your intention is clear and I am thankful that we Indians don't need to count on you. Of course, its interesting that you are quite happy being a US Citizen when it's the US which has called the LTTE a terrorist organization. Hmm, I hope you did your research. Anyway, too late. We don't need you anymore in India and like I said earlier, good riddance. All the best!
Thanks for being the self-designated, unpaid spokesperson for "we indians" and keeping track of accountable indians :)
Thanks for being the self-designated, unpaid spokesperson for "we indians" and keeping track of accountable indians :)
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TeddyKoochu
09-17 03:09 PM
Yeah that might be true.
The rate at which 2004 folks are getting approved that probably only 300 applications are left for pre Jan 2005. More approvals augur well for everybody.
The rate at which 2004 folks are getting approved that probably only 300 applications are left for pre Jan 2005. More approvals augur well for everybody.
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BharatPremi
07-11 12:48 PM
BharatPremi,
Same applies to you.. If you are so crazy about Bharat, what are you doing here.... HEHEHE. Just thought that it was kinda funny statement because of your name....BharatPremi --- :D
My "Avtar Name" is "BharatPremi" not "BharatVasi" To do "Prem" you do not have to be "vasi":)
Same applies to you.. If you are so crazy about Bharat, what are you doing here.... HEHEHE. Just thought that it was kinda funny statement because of your name....BharatPremi --- :D
My "Avtar Name" is "BharatPremi" not "BharatVasi" To do "Prem" you do not have to be "vasi":)
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boreal
05-29 01:42 PM
Ok, the guy that sets the dates says that he sees no possibility of dates moving forward for EB India and ppl are still thinking there is hope? I am an optimist and try to see the brighter side - and that side here is that we know there is no hope for those past 2005 in the next two years. That to me is sufficient to make decisions and move on. Be it changing to a different job or going back to the home country - most probably the former for me.
prem_goel
05-29 03:02 PM
I've met couple of guys who came on L1 and have filed GC in EB1. they are simply project managers and exploited this loop hole... I'd raised this issue earlier but was scoffed stating that I would have done the same if I would have been at their place...Felt like slapping the guy who made this stupid comment.
Given that we have played by the rules, lets prevent any kind of fraud to make sure that there is FIFO.....
Please PM me if you have the details.
Given that we have played by the rules, lets prevent any kind of fraud to make sure that there is FIFO.....
Please PM me if you have the details.
Jerrome
05-01 04:20 PM
What do you mean by some tamilians killed, almost 10 thousand people killed in 2 months.
Personally i don't believe 2000 terrorists could hold hostages of 3 or 4 lakh people for 2 years.
Do you know or read reports that daily 5000 bombs are dropped on civilian areas to make them to run towards the army.Do you know that the army poisoned the drinking water and people ran towards army without food or water and now they are in Nazi like camps.
It is not released by the LTTE but released by the UN.
No Second opinion about killing terrosists, but killing innocent people is not acceptable at any cost.
Personally i don't believe 2000 terrorists could hold hostages of 3 or 4 lakh people for 2 years.
Do you know or read reports that daily 5000 bombs are dropped on civilian areas to make them to run towards the army.Do you know that the army poisoned the drinking water and people ran towards army without food or water and now they are in Nazi like camps.
It is not released by the LTTE but released by the UN.
No Second opinion about killing terrosists, but killing innocent people is not acceptable at any cost.
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